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HomeMy WebLinkAboutCity Council Committees - Civil Services Commission - 03/22/1984 KENT CIVIL SERVICE COMMISSION SPECIAL MEETING MINUTES March 22, 1984 The special meeting of the Commission was called to order at 7:05 p.m. by • Chairman T. Richard Ried. Commissioners Joseph Street and Donald Whitener, Chief Angelo, Assistant Chiefs Berg and LaBore, Battalion Chiefs Bond and Fronsdahl were in attendance. Also present: Firefighters Felczak, Hertlein, Jennings, Bob Johnson, Nutter, Rideout, Shepard and Weatherill. M. Somerville and Mrs. Rideout were also present. Chairman announced that this special meeting was called to evaluate the ques- tionnaires that were turned in regarding the Lieutenant examination. He asked for comments regarding the test. Firefighter Jennings stated that the impact of any promotional test lives with them for many years and his personal concern is to do the best he can to insure the testing process is valid and that they can improve the system as they go along. Chief Angelo commented that it is worthwhile to make a review of the process. In reference to Mr. Street's concern at the last meeting about not having seen the questionnaires, Chief Angelo clarified that the questionnaires are an informal process to obtain feedback and not a formal method to make protests. He ex- plained that the questionnaires were put out by the department to do, exactly as Jennings said, to hopefully gain knowledge from each test, that the more information you get, the better you can do each time. Of the returned ques- tionnaires, copies of which were provided the Commission, Chief Angelo said eight were received prior to the last Commission meeting, the -next four, includ- ing Jennings', were received after the meeting, and one was received tonight. He noted the similarity in comments of those received after the meeting both in grammar and wording. The main concerns of the comments, he noted, were concerns about the tactical problem and another area was organizational maturity. He related the dimensions by which all events were measured and said he felt the dimensions do address some of the concerns about organizational maturft)r, He said he agreed with Jennings that improvements can be made and. he also added that no testing process can be perfect, but that there being no documen- tation of a candidate's abilities and weaknesses, the dimensions are used to measure it. He said the areas chosen in the dimension, he felt, gave a balanced look of the candidates. In respect to the tactical problem, he asked Assistant Chief Berg to show the Commission exactly how he ran the test. At this time Chief Berg went through the entire tactical portion of the exam with slides, script and information for the candidates. After the conclusion of the presentation, Chief Angelo requested the secretary's impression and feedbacks received after the testing. Secretary related she was present in six separate sessions of the tactical problem and that she spoke by phone with the evaluators after the exam, including the tactical evaluators. She said she received all favorable comments on the test measuring organiza- tional ability and individual maturity, and also positive comments on the assess- ment center on sufficient information and time allowed for the exam. Chief Angelo pointed out that the evaluators were selected from the immediate area with nothing to gain by association with the department. He noted there was one comment that there was too much information. He explained that this year there was more information-and more papers provided, and with 20 candidates, it is important to be standard, that all instructions given by Chief Berg were read from a prepared sheet and each candidate received the same information. • Timewise, he said the times given were appropriate and it was intended to create some stress. One of the dimensions to be measured was stress tolerance to find how well one will react under those conditions. Lastly, he said the evaluators graded separately and he believed them to be consistent and objective Kent Civil Service Commission Special Meeting Minutes - Page 2 March 22, 1984 from his observations. He requested the Commission not to release the dimen- sions or description of dimensions so as not to compromise future testing. Copies of Jennings' questionnaire were made available to the Commission. The secretary had received a copy that day. Assistant Chief LaBore made copies for the Commissioners during the meeting. Referring to the tactical problem, Commissioner Whitener asked Chief Berg if the exercise was weighted and how many responses they were looking for in the exercise. Assistant Chief Berg responded that it was weighted and the evaluators were looking for five responses: establishment of a water supply, attack capability to keep the fire from spreading, deployment of their resources, mechanism to receive feedback from inside the structure and search and rescue. Chief Angelo added that in addition to those responses, the evaluators were looking for confidence, leadership, decisiveness and other qualities to measure the dimensions. In response to Firefighter Nutter's question as to what they were looking for when asked to relate their concerns in the tactical problem, Chief Berg replied that it was size-up, the problems that concerned him the most. Nutter said that was one area that he was concerned about. Firefighter Jennings claimed the tactical problem was unrealistic because there was too much information and that a person's judgment and what he would do under pressure cannot be measured this way. He further stated that people with the most experience did most poorly on this test. He said he had asked Chief Berg questions relative to the fire problem, but was not given answers. He said the areal problem is that he has never been trained on how to do an • assessment lab and he asked why the senior people did not do so well when they do fine every day of the week. Chief Angelo explained that having taken and seen tests put together, it is easy to pick a building or facility that is in one person's district where others may not have seen that area and in his mind, that justifies the extra informa- tion. He said all the candidates were given the same material and were told that those were the resources for them to use and the idea was for them to make some decisions. In respect to training for the assessment center, Chief Angelo explained that the department conducted night sessions at two separate times with notices given to all individuals interested in taking the test to attend.but, unfortunately, Bob was not available at that time because he decided to apply later. He said a simulation of the last test was set up, going through the basics and candidates were told they would have a limited time to voice their concerns. He declared the Lieutenant exam was a fair test and the tactical problem was a feasible scenario with all the candidates having the same information, same resources, same amount of time and same evaluators. Jennings stated he had participated in three different Lieutenant tests, none of which was the same as the last one. He further stated that this test didn't cover the same areas as the last one.and that there appears to be a lack of direction of what should be tested. He said that the two tests that Chief Angelo has giveo,the areas tested were different and the results speak for themselves. He added that from their own performance, they have demon- strated that not enough time was taken to look at what should be tested for, how the test should be done and why. • Chief Angelo asked Jennings to expand on the last test, what was different? Jennings responded that there was an oral board in the last test and none on this test, with a training presentation in place of it. Prior to that, he said they had an oral board, written, personnel and tactical problem. He Kent Civil Service Commission Special Meeting Minutes - Page 3 March 22, 1984 went on to elaborate on the first test he took and said tht he didn't consider • that one too valid either. He maintained tht they have the means to fulfill the temporary vacancies in the Fire Department for a period of up to 6 months without jeopardizing the effectiveness, that they are looking adter their own future. Chief Angelo replied that, having been involved in personnel, it is not uncommon to have different events in different tests, tht the idea is to measure different dimensions demanded by the job. He related that an oral board allows a person to come across with their ability to convey their knowledge and impression. He explained that the point is not how the questions are answered, but to observe the person's confidence, knowledge and his ability to deal with a stressful situation and many of these can be dealt with in other categories as well as in the presentation. He said he has never encountered a jurisdiction that constantly gave the same building or difficulty in the tactical problem. He stressed the importance of a consistent evaluation system which allows documenting things that may be translated in an objective way at the time of decision. He said he strongly believes that many of the senior people that did not place high in the test are of high quality and very good. He affirmed that the 'test was fairly given and did measure ability;: in conjuntion with a valid and consistently used evaluation system. He acknowledged that the process can be improved, but his concern is that if the tactical problem was so difficult or confusing, he would think the less experienced people would be at a more serious disadvantage with it. Jennings remarked to Chief Angelo that his responses to him were totally different from when he talked to him immediately after the test and now he's taking the opposite stand. He said that he didn't say the test wasn't fair, but that the test is incomplete. He further stated he has no intention of taking another test if • one was ordered, as he has nothing to gain from it. To the Chairman's question, City Attorney DiJulio advised the Commission it is a quasi-judicial board and can adjourn to recess to deliberate on their decision. Chief Angelo responded to Jennings that he did listen to what he had to say that day but did not say he agreed with everything he said. He said he did say that he understood his feelings and he explained to him that there were a lot of scenarios and he can't explain why some individuals who had more experience didn't do better. He emphasized that he has nothing to gain or lose and no ill feelings towards the candidates if the Commission wants them to retest. He said he personally cannot recommend retesting, but will remain open to the Commission's decision. Battalion Chief Fronsdahl expressed his observations that he had listened to conversations on both sides and voiced his feelings that the administration chose the direction and put on a test that was totally objective and that everyone had the same 'shot'. He noted that they have a list which, as the Chief had said, people on top are surprises, but Chief Fronsdahl claimed that maybe those people were kept back and not paid attention to before. He further stated that the test was fair as coud be, that the Chiefs chose the direction of the test, different segments of it, and how it should be graded and weighted. Chairman informed that the decision to hold a new test or to certify the list will be announced at a meeting Tuesday at 7t00 p.m. , location to be determined the next day. Firefighter Nutter thanked the Commission for taking the time to review the • questionnaires. Kent Civil Service Commission Special Meeting Minutes - Page 4 March 22, 1984 • Meeting was adjourned at 8:15 p.m. Respectfully submitted, Amy E. Kato Secretary and Chief Examiner Approved: T. Richard Ried Chairman • •